Inverted Orthodoxy 438- Making Pastors Squirm: Nephilim & Retrofitted Prophecy

Forgive me, I always enjoy making pastors squirm with awkward questions, it brings me great joy ;)Genesis 6 and extra-biblical texts like the book of Enoch suggest the Son’s of God were likely fallen angels who were heavenly beings (ie not human by origin/species). 

The Bible states these beings were attracted to the daughters of men and slept with these women and produced offspring (which we widely assume to be the Nephilim). See Heiser, Boyd, Collins, N.T WRIGHT, etc.

This poses some interesting questions for me and frankly questions I’ve NEVER seen addressed in any theology books I’ve read regarding angel/demonology. 

First, this implies that Angels have all the necessary working parts to procreate. To be blunt, Angels would have to have penises and capable of producing semen. This sperm would have to be compatible with humans. This seems odd to say the least. If we can’t impregnate across species ie chimpanzees than how can an angel reproduce with us? Moreover, why would God design it in such a way?

Second, without being too graphic, the idea of a giant being having sexual intercourse with a human seems impractical. Frankly, the pieces shouldn’t fit. Although some authors suggest giants might only be 10ft tall but likely larger.

Third, this would suggests that at least some heavenly beings, (specifically the fallen ones like Lucifer) would have been designed to reproduce in the same coitical manner as us humans are designed to. Based on these texts we must deduce that if they had all the working parts and able to produce life-giving sperm than at least some angels are designed to reproduce. (I’m sure God’s intention was with each other). 

Aaaaand, if it were not a “physical”reproduction in this way but a spiritual impregnation than what does that say of Christ’s unique and spiritual immaculate conception?

Finally, we can also deduce that there would have to be both male and female type archetypal beings. Is this contrary to Jesus words about male and female in heaven and Gal 3:28-29?

I won’t even mention the spiritual/physical implications this holds about the heavenly realm.

Feb 14- 

Today in my devotions I was reading John 19 and once again I noticed a recurring hermeneutical challenge for me that I seems to happen a lot within Scripture. 

There seems to be an apparent phenomenon of retrospective or “retro-fitted” prophecy that often occurs in scripture especially surrounding Jesus life. 

For instance, in John 19:19–24, John presents the division? of Christ’s garments as a fulfillment of Scripture, referencing to Psalm 22. Yet, within its original context, Psalm 22 appears to be a firsthand lament of David, not an explicitly forward-looking prophecy. This raises some critical issues for me: to what extent are these Old Testament texts inherently prophetic, and to what extent are they later recontextualized by New Testament authors in light of Christological events? To put it plainly they seem forced! 

This same pattern appears frequently across scripture. I am personally ok with a layered / dual horizon of meaning. However, this creates a methodological problem and on a personal level - a challenge to my faith. I am less convinced of the amount of prophetic fulfilments that I was brought up believing there to be when so many of them are retrospective and reaching:/

How can we truly distinguish between texts that were intentionally prophetic in their origin and those that are later interpreted as prophetic by reflection? At what point does perceived fulfillment move from divinely intended to interpretive mere coincidence?

Furthermore, I have noticed that the heretical duo -Doug and Kyle (Not so much Saint Blake) look at the apocalyptic literature in the book of Revelation more as writings for it’s time -Primarily addressed to its immediate historical audience who would be able to decipher it’s symbols. (Hays, Gorman, NT Wright)

Could it not be a more coherent reading of the apocalyptic scripture to understand these texts as operating simultaneously on multiple “temporal planes” —speaking both to their contemporary audience and to future realities? The now and the not yet? 

Should biblical prophecy only be understood as a fixed or one off intention in the original text, or more as a dynamic, unfolding and even reoccurring framework?

Feb 18- my question about retro fitted prophesies , I forgot to add the other two that appear at the end of John 19

Vs36 not one of his bones will be broken (exodus , numbers , psalms) - none of which are intentionally prophetic

That he was pierced (Zech)

Just kidding about the heretics comment, but Doug doesn’t get called one enough;) keep up the good work pastors!